Nespresso? At the Fat Duck?
I was shocked to find out that The Fat Duck, regularly voted one of the world's top restuarants, has sold out its coffee operation to Nespresso (see here and here). It's not that I think Nespresso (the pod coffee system owned by Nescafe) is evil or particularly bad. But according to the coffee geeks I've spoken to, it just isn't terribly good. And for a restaurant like the Fat Duck, you'd expect them to be perfectionist about everything. Including the coffee.From the Nespresso website:
"A coffee that appeals to the greatest chefs
Heston Blumenthal, chef of the renowned English Michelin-3-star restaurant "The Fat Duck", succumbed to the exceptional quality of Nespresso coffees, which - in his opinion - are meant to be tasted like great wines: first with the eyes, then with the nose and finally with the mouth."
So why have 18 of the world's top 50 restaurants (or thereabouts) opted for Nespresso and their exclusive coffee supplier? It may be because of the convenience of these systems for a busy restuarant (this I'd understand for a less exalted establishment), but isn't it more likely to be because Nespresso have specifically targeted these top restaurants, and are rumoured to pay a fee for this exclusivity. [Note added later: since I posted this, a PR company working for Nespresso have denied that there is any payment for exclusivity at restaurants using Nespresso.]
I think it's a nutty decision.
Labels: coffee, restaurants
posted by Jamie @ 10:07 AM
69 comments
links to this post
69 Comments:
Yeah, totally agree. Sellout all over.
Nespresso is a coffè of very high quality,on average it's made by 95%of Arabica and that means that it's much better than all the other coffe (except Illy caffè, which is 100% Arabica), but it has more than 16 variations plus the machines of high technology and great design!!! All the blind tests made have shown significant positive results: more than 60% like better Nespresso than Lavazza (most famous italian coffe brand which uses around 60% of Arabica), but they associate it with the "not shining" past of Nestlé(the owner of Nespresso)....Simply, in the end is goood..
He this the famous Fat Duck that was closed some months ago with some bacteria infection?!?!?!
I'd be disappointed to be served any branded product at such a restaurant......
Have you actually tried Nespresso, Jamie?
No, thought not.
You're just appealing to the snobs out there, who you think will agree with you.
Lavazza is boring mainstream. So it would be much more interesting to compare against a small scale producer. or do you compare 3 star food against a burger as well?
And just because a cofee is made of 95% Arabica is not a prof that it is exceptionally good either. Or do you believe that a wine made of 95%Shiraz is better than one made of 90% as well?
The comment doesn't say "exclusively" so it may well just be in the kitchen for staff.
having never tasted nespresso so can't comment on quality, is there anybody who has tried it and doesn't sound like nespresso PR?
Roger, what are u talking about? Every product is branded! could be a private label or any other....but some one sold it to the restaurant! Do u mean a "famous" brand? Could it be that it's famous 'cos it's good..?
I think the quality of Nespresso is excellent, not that I'm an expert.
But there is no way that Heston Blumenthal would use them in his restaurant if he didn't think they were good enough - no way in the world.
Anon (2) - that's a little aggressive, isn't it? Actually, I became acquainted with Nespresso at the Landmark tutorial - our rooms in the Louise were equipped with one, and I used it quite a bit. Highly convenient and perfect for an in-room hotel situation. But a compromise. The coffee was good, but not outstanding (mind, I'm no coffee expert...). Michelin starred restaurants shouldn't have to make such compromises.
I have enjoyed the odd cup at a mate's place and in corporate meeting rooms. It is consistantly good, regardless of location because it removes the variables.
That said, when I go to a restaurant of this cailbre I am expecting something hand crafted with their individual stamp on it. Not a coffee from a capsule that you can buy at Tescos.
Nespresso is good for the home and good enough for corporate caterring but not a 3 Michelin star restaurant.
Gregory
Anonymous...probably u're an expert, but many people think that Lavazza is the best italian coffe, so the best coffe....anyway! Being of 95% Arabica it's not sufficient, but it's necessary. and the small scale producer does not have the same economic possibility of Nestlé that can afford to monitor all the practices to harvest, grind, and roast the coffe...
Ups, i just saw now that u wrote u are not an expert.. it was by chance that i wrote the same :P
I wonder if corporate image plays as great a role in coffee tasting as in wine?
actually i don't know how many restaurants produce their own coffe....but i guess not many...?
Yes Glen, absolutely, i was saying before that in Italy (where Lavazza is the most sold coffe brand) blind tests have shown that most people prefer Nespresso coffe, if they don't know it's Nestlé..
Jamie was assuming that just because it's Nestlé, it can't be good.
What would you say is an "outstanding" coffee, Jamie? Can you name a few for us?
I am a bit disappointed about this! Nespresso is all right, but it is surely nothing special (as pointed out by another comment, even Illy is 100% arabica), and with such good independent coffee sources such as Monmouth Coffee Co. and such in the UK these days, you'd expect a place like the Fat Duck (and a curious, innovative and micro-managing chef such as Heston) to seek out some really interesting choices for coffee at the restaurant...oh well, hopefully not all fine restaurants will follow suit!
Thanks Viola, you're right all products are branded. You've made me think a little more about why I'd be disappointed to be served a Nespresso at The Fat Duck and I think it's down to the lack of any creativity. I would expected the Fat Duck (or similar) to create a house coffee blend, small producer beans, large producer beans, mixture of both ?. I don't really mind that much but dislike the coffee being the same as that served in 1000's of other establishments.
I'm not so much anti-brand (or even famous brand) but pro-variety...
Hoots Mon i totally agree with you.. a restaurant that has won the "Second Best Restaurant In The World" award could be able to have its own coffe blend. My intention was not to defend the restaurant, but Nespresso among the other coffe producers..I think all the prejudices come from the fact that it's a relatively new company, so people do not perceive it linked to the tradition of coffe...
I would be interested to put Nespresso into a blind tasting. We have a machine in the office and it's pretty good. I guess if you didn't know it was from a pod you probably wouldn't guess.
Surely Heston should be serving coffee in an ice cube or something though?
In addition going back to the question posed
"So why have 18 of the world's top 50 restaurants (or thereabouts) opted for Nespresso and their exclusive coffee supplier? "
No-one here has openly said that the coffee is bad and Viola has stated some stats on the people who like/prefer it over other coffees.
So the answer ? I suspect is that the coffee is good enough and if Nestle is waving around a fat marketing check to associate its product with high-end creative restaurants then they'll take the cheque.
No brainer ?
I cant beleive the response to this blog. I think Nestle have played a blinder, being able to place one of its products at the premium end of the market after all Jo Malone fragrances are made by Estée Lauder and people still pay a premium for the fragrances.
This post has been removed by the author.
Oh well, one can always have a pot of tea for £35 there instead! I sad some amazing coffee the other day from artisan roaster, Giani Frasi. The beans were still moist. Incredibly long-lived - wrecked the wine tasting afterwards!
Surely the offer of 50 grand played some part in all this.
I agree with the comment that I would expect the Fat Duck (and many other top restaurants) to create their own blends. Providores do a fantastic one with Monmouth House.
It is interesting also that artisan teas and tisanes are on the up and up whilst coffee is seen here as "dumbing down".
By the way I have tasted Nespresso and it is adequate but not good enough for a great restaurant. The greatest restaurants take enormous care with the details and I'm afraid that this contract sounds like an entirely commercial decision.
I'm no coffee "expert" but surely a coffee lover who is discerning about the origin and quality of the brew.
Nespresso is a decently good coffee - as much thanks to the machine as to the beans - but qualitatively it is positioned roughly where Moet & Chandon Brut Imperial is in the world of wine. It would be disappointing of any ambitious restaurant to remove their champagne list in favour of M&Ch exclusivity?
Plus nobody mentions that Nespresso pods contain pre-ground coffee, so there are weeks if not months between beans are ground and coffee is made from them at the Fat Duck
Surely this is missing the quality standards of espresso making by light years.
You'd expect beans to be roasted within days and ground for you on the premises not only at a *** restaurant but at any half-decent café.
This whole thread is nonsense, though.
Someone who knows nothing about coffee trying to make some big statement.
I love coffee. I've had nespresso. It's OK, but there is no question it's not the best, full stop. And so I am not convinced Mr Blumental's decision is based on taste rather than money.
Btw, since when has Nestlé been a "new company"?! They've been doing coffee for decades.
I think this is a bit dissapointing. Pre-fab coffee is not what I would be expecting at Fat Duck. That they take care with the intricate details of their food,wine, service and ambience and then farm coffee out to commerce is a shame. I've had Nespresso and frankly, it's crap.
I've also tasted Nespresso coffee and been disappointed with it. I can see the convenience factor, which must appeal to restaurants as well as a large majority of people who favour convenience over the effort needed for the last ~ 2-3% of quality.
Of 'brands' Caffe Vergnano from Italy (Torino I believe) is very good to my tastes. No distribution in the UK, though IIRC there is a Vergnano coffee shop in London.
However, as others have pointed out, there are plenty of independant roasters who do a very fine job and it's these folk who get most of my business. Also one would expect somewhere like the Fat Duck to get bespoke blends, potentially going so far as individual estate beans, roasted to their specification. Indeed their reputation would suggest they'd look at getting their own roaster if necessary!
Yes, I can only see this as a 'sponsorship' arrangement and agree with others that it's an embarassment for these restaurants to be part of such an arrangement.
Hopefully we'll hear what the precise arrangements are, or at least from other restaurants who turned down Nestle's money - and hear exactly what they were offered.
What next? E&J Gallo supplying the same restaurants with wine? Tesco supplying their produce?
regards
I LOVE Nespresso! It's consistently delicious!I have one every day!
To those asking if Jamie's drunk Nespresso before, my question for you is 'have you eaten Michelin 3 star before?' This, for me, is the issue at hand. If you're going to cough the amount of money one needs to in order to eat at The Fat Duck, I think one as a right to expect better. Nespresso is not bad, but I'd be reticent to consider it worthy of such a restaurant.
For a restaurant such as the Fat Duck to have pre-packaged coffee is a nonsense - full stop - end of story.
Nespresso is not crap, it is just pure snobbery on the part of people who wouldn't be seen dead drinking a Nestle product.
To compare it with the crap that Gallo churn out is nonsense.
You would think that Blumenthal is quite conscious of his image, so you think he'd risk that by serving piss-poor coffee? It's not as if he needs the money.
Anonymous - you are wrong. It has nothing to do with "snobbery" whatsoever and everything to do with freshly ground coffee beans as opposed to something that has been in a plastic container for months on end. By the way, if you believe that money had nothing to do with it then how do you explain that Nespresso gave The Fat Duck £50,000 to serve only their coffee? Explain that one then???
Personally I have not had nespresso but have nothing against it but for an establishment like the Fat Duck it does seem a little lazy + agree the quality cannot be as good as freshly roasted and groud coffee.
I wonder what the mark up is? If cheaper coffee means lower mark up on the wine then a good thing (after all you don't drink the coffe with the food!) but guess this is unlikely.
What about the additional amount of [non-compostable, non-recyclable (?)] waste generated by Nespresso versus the traditional method?
Jamie,
is this one of your most commented posts ever ?
Agree that michelin starred places shouldnt be cutting corners. Having seen Heston make pizza dough that took 2 days to make I would highly doubt he is using coffee pods.
Have never tasted the coffee so cannot comment on the quality.
..hmmmm....well...apparently he'll use them if you give him £50,000.....
being 100% arabica does nothing to guaranty quality, being Nespesso however does. It is better than both mellow birds and gold blend, I for one an pleased to see heston gained something from his time at Little Chef
I've had plenty of run-ins with Nespresso machines, including one at a place I used to work at, and one a few weeks ago in a hotel room. The crema's good, the coffee's nice but not excellent - but it's obviously not freshly ground, and you can, I'm afraid, taste the difference. If you drink a cup of Nespresso and then go somewhere like Bar Italia in Soho or (as someone mentioned above) the Monmouth St Coffee House, there's a clear difference in quality - and I'm not a coffee snob, and I don't really care how evil or otherwise Nestle are.
Keller's done the same thing, which is interesting in that the two of them are often hyperbolised together! He uses the Illy pods that look like teabags at Bouchon (he's had his Unic machines adjusted to take the things, would you believe), with the justification that they produce a more consistent espresso if an unskilled person is manning the machine. My understanding is that he's *not* using pods at the French Laundry though - lovely as Bouchon is, it's a much more casual affair. What a shame, though that he and Heston both seem to have gone for mechanised consistency rather than good training. I'd have been surprised to see Nespresso at the Hind's Head, let alone the Fat Duck.
Wow! Clearly people care a whole lot more about coffee (or maybe branding) then they do about wine!
I have been working in coffee sales in my home land since early this year and to be honest during a period of research to seek out my companies competition it has become evident that most restaurants don't really care about the quality of their coffee. We import our own beans and roast to order however most restaurants choose to deal with generic coffee brands (illy, Lazazza) who yes use Arabica coffee but do not give you any indication on when the coffee was roasted or in fact where this coffee and its growing origins are. From a roasting perspective its imperative to know when it was roasted to obviously gauge freshness. To a degree its perhaps understandable that during the current economic crisis that restauarants choose a more branded product as they usually come from large companies who have the ability to beat everyone elae where price is concerned.However from a consumer point of view this is not ideal. The same can be said of restaurants when it comes to wine many relinquishing quality over price.
I'm afraid it appears that there are just as many coffee snobs on here as there are wine snobs.
And, among 44 comments, only ONE person has been able to name one or two coffee brands they feel would be appropriate for The Fat Duck to use.
That says it all: most people, in fact, know precious little about coffee, but are happy to denigrate a big brand.
8.03am anon
If I wouldn't be seen dead drinking Nespresso, then why did I try it? To judge for myself, without prejudice.
No I didn't call it crap, but like Liz and Gregory said, you can taste the difference.
Do try out some good specialist coffee shops and see what you think of them. Maybe you'll still prefer Nespresso, maybe you won't but still appreciate it's convenience.
It's sad (but not at all surprising) to hear Robert's experiences with restaurants. Many seem to care very little about wine (apart from the juicy markups), so little surprise that it's as bad or worse for coffee. I expect 99+% of restauranters got into the trade because they love food and that is their focus. The rest is more peripheral to them, though not so true for their customers.
This story all sounds a bit suspect anyway, but what a response!
This is all very straight forward common sense - Heston has sold out in a rough economic climate to packaged coffee - Anon is clearly a Nespresso employee - what a muppet.
Who are you calling a muppet?
I am not "a Nespresso employee", but it's amazing how quick everyone is to sneer at the concept, yet no one is able to suggest a credible alternative.
Sorry but remember that you have been calling everyone a snob - this is crap.
...and have you not been reading? There have been MANY credible alternatives given so far - MNAY of them...
Er, like I said: two credible alternatives: Giani Frasi,
Caffe Vergnano.
Didn't realise that Illy and Lavazza counted, given the way they've been slagged off on here.
So, hardly MANY, then (or MNAY, as you wrote it!)
And the £50,000 - what do you have to say about that?
In his original post, Jamie wrote: is more likely to be because Nespresso have specifically targeted these top restaurants, and pay a fee for this exclusivity (in the case of the Fat Duck, one figure I have heard is £50,000).
So, speculation, not fact.
...or covering my a**?
..and what do you think Anonymous?....do you think Heston has taken £50,000 in a tough economic environment to serve coffee that you believe the "snobs" won't like?
I don't know, Anonymous.
Do you?
Yes I do know the answer to this question.
wowowo! i leave the discussion for a day and see how many comments!For the pleasure of stats, I've checked some numbers... Nestlè is relatively new if u consider that it entered the coffe market in 1940 with Nescafè, and Nespresso was born in the 1986! While Illy was founded in the 1933, Lavazza in the 1895, and Caffè Vergnano is the oldest, 1882. Even in the website of Vergnano it's written that the finest type of coffe is Arabica (it's written in the adv message of one of their pdt, the one with 100% arabica). All the other products, instead, are a mix with Robusta. Among all those brands, again, Illy his the only one with coffe 100%arabica. Anyway, i didn't know about the £50,000....but economics laws teach that if the product is not good u'll know it, sooner or later. And for the lovers of coffe/wine: the finest gourmet or specialty coffè are only the 10% of the green coffe's worldwide production. Among these, only a percentage btw 10 and 20 corresponds to the highest qualitative standars.
Dear "Viola" - what is Blue Mountain coffee? - isn't that meant to be the "finest" in the world? Presumably that is 100% Arabica?
In all the talk of coffee excellence and brands, no one has mentioned that the majority of people who order coffee then don't actually drink coffee. They dilute it with milk, pile in sugar and sometimes dust it with chocolate powder. So why should they or Heston care about where the beans were grown ?
As for using brands... Heston buys in bottled wines and just opens and pours them. Taking some of the coffee arguments to the logical conclusion he should be buying the grapes and making his wines too.
And if you order an after dinner brandy or licquer it'll be a brand.
Food is what he prepares.
Nespresso is, quite simply, brilliant. I rarely have coffee when we go out these days because it's rarely as good as what we have at home. Come round for dinner one day & you can try it after we polish off the Yquem.
Liz has summed it up perfectly. There is no need to say any more.
Although I had every reason to believe my source was a good one, I've been asked to remove the reference to payment by a PR company working for Nespresso, and have amended the post in light of this.
Either they do pay or they don't!
Jamie, have the courage of your convictions, and keep it on the blog.
Don't be bullied by PR companies panicking at what their client might say.
Jamie
Did the PR company declare that no payment has / will be made to the Fat Duck for placement of Nespresso machines?
Maybe they'd like to come on here and state that none of the restaurants in that list have been paid / subsidised (by Nestle / Nespresso or a company acting on their behalf) to take Nespresso on in the restaurant.
That would I'm sure clear this issue up and I'd welcome such assurance from them...
Ian, I'm going to pursue this one.
Nespresso = Nestlé = Taster's Choice
Need we say more?
Look, a ristretto is a flavor with Nespresso... it's not even a beverage preparation. This is akin to buying a plate of ground beef at a restaurant and having them tell you it is Chateaubriand-flavored.
I am a nespresso convert, Reading the literature that comes with the capsules it states that the coffee beans are ground in an atmosphere free of oxygen and then sealed in the capsules. The first time the coffee comes into contact with air is when it is coming out of the Nespresso coffee machine. the crema is great and I would say Nespresso coffee is better than over 90% of coffee shop coffee that I have tasted.
Post a Comment
Links to this post:
Create a Link
<< Home